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(Forum for members to discuss the use of anabolic steroids)

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  1. #1
    Novice Bullfx's Avatar
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    Default Confused as hell ... Still dont know shit about dieting
    hey guys need some help here. I Have been reading so much on how to diet and yet i dont know jack. last cutting cycle i had i lost 30lbs of weight went from 21% to 13% but Shit i lost ALOT of strength even on lots of AS.

    I dont know if i should go 40/30/30 p/c/f or 30/40/30? Or if i should do keto? Should i eat carbs only before/after workout? Im about 188lbs now @ 5'6 and 15% wana get to 8% ...

    I did a search on this site and it only made me more confused. come on please help a brother out point me to the right direction!


    ::BULLFX::

  2. #2
    Junior Bodybuilder heregothere's Avatar
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    everybody's body works differently. i would recommend that you just experiment with your diet (try a 40/40/20 for a month and keep a detailed log; rotate the next month to a 30/40/30).

    when vets tell you to 'get your diet in check' they are really saying 'find out what works for you and stick to it'.

    good luck.

  3. #3
    Novice Bullfx's Avatar
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    hey thanks bro, do u think i should stay away from simple carbs and stick to complex carbs or other way around?

  4. #4
    Co-Founder TxLonghorn's Avatar
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    heregothere gave you some good advice

    I'd say start out like on iso 33/33/33 and tweak from there. Also, a basic diet to lose fat will start at limiting your calories to around 10-12 cals/lb. Don't go lower, otherwise your body goes into starvation mode.

    Also, limit carb intake after 6pm is usually advised.

  5. #5
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    Hi Gi carb bro.

    Wheat bread, Oatmeal, brown rice, baked pot...

    those are good carbs when dieting.

    M56M

  6. #6
    Co-Founder TxLonghorn's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Bullfx
    hey thanks bro, do u think i should stay away from simple carbs and stick to complex carbs or other way around?
    Stay away from simple carbs as much as possible except after your workout.

  7. #7
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    Complex carbs an hour before a workout. Just make sure its a shake

  8. #8
    Junior Bodybuilder Focker's Avatar
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    The key to losing fat is Ketosis. Starve your body of carbs for over 24 hrs and your in. I had a diet plan that I found on some site that showed how to cylce your body in and out of ketosis every 4 days by limiting and then spiking carb intake. Suposedly you can shed 1lb on avereage for each 4 day run. I'll see if I can find the article for ya.

  9. #9
    Junior Bodybuilder Focker's Avatar
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    Here it is. Sorry but I can't credit the site because they sell roids.

    HI-LOW CARB DIET

    Although the major emphasis of most bodybuilders programs is centered on gaining weight, sooner or later, every athlete reaches a point at which they need to shed some fat. For many, cutting up is necessary for a contest; many others divide their yearly training into cutting and bulking phases in an effort to build muscle and limit their accumulation of body fat. As we will see in the following text, there are a number of valid reasons for going through regular cutting cycles even if you do not compete. It takes an abundance of nutrition to build serious muscle mass, in fact, there is little room for debate that nutrition is the single most important factor in muscular hypertrophy. As we have reiterated, a daily calorie intake of at least 4,000 calories seems to accelerate the muscle building process dramatically in athletes who regularly train with heavy weights. This effect is even more dramatic in lifters who take steroids of course. During a bulking diet, it is likely that, along with the gain in muscle mass, a nice layer of body fat will accumulate. Although you can't worry about fat gains during an all-out bulking cycle, eventually fat can become a road block on the path to muscle mass. It is not uncommon for a lifter to put on 5 pounds of fat for every pound of muscle in a bulking cycle. Depending upon the length of the hulking effort, the lifter could end up with somewhere in the area of 10 pounds of extra fat. Lets say the lifter just keeps that fat during his level or off cycle time and then proceeds with another bulking cycle. During the next bulking effort he might gain an additional 10 pounds of
    fat. Obviously, this leads to a substantial accumulation of fat, This fat has many negative aspects including:

    1) AN UNHEALTHY LIPID PROFILE: High body fat levels raise cholesterol and increase risk of heart disease,
    2) A DECREASE IN BMR: The more body fat a person has, the lower their basal metabolic rate. This means slower muscle growth.
    3) SLUGGISH PERFORMANCE: As a lifter acquires more fat, they often have reduced energy levels. This can lead to poor training endurance.
    4) REDUCED APPETITE FOR NUTRITIOUS FOODS: Research has discovered a link between body fat levels and appetite. Persons with high body fat can develop a condition where they only get satiety from high fat foods; this makes dieting even more difficult.
    5) HYPERTENSION: High body fat can increase blood pressure and can lead to an increased risk of vascular disease.
    6) POOR MOTIVATION: Very often a lifter will become content with being fat if it means looking 'bigger.' They resist a decrease in body weight and fear they will look skinny if they diet. In fact, they are most likely inhibiting further muscle augmentation by clinging to their “adipose security blanket”. These athletes usually do not have the motivation to force change and improvement in their physiques.

    The answer to all these problems is to regularly go on "fat reducing” diets like the one that follows. It is designed for weight training athletes only. I call it the Hi-Lo Carb Diet. It has been proven effective time and time again. This diet applies sound logic in a relatively simple and very realistic eating regimen. I've used it many times to cut up for contests and have applied it to dozens of lifters I have trained over the years, This diet is great because it does not cause the body to lose muscle mass, in fact, it is possible to build muscle while on this program, although not at a significant rate. Here's how the program looks.

    HI-LO CARB DIET:
    Each cycle lasts four days. One cycle follows the next. Number of
    consecutive cycles ranges from 5 to 12.

    DAY 1: Moderate carbohydrate intake, 1.5 grams per lb. of body weight
    Moderate protein intake, 1 gram per lb. of body weight
    Low fat intake, 1/4 gram for each lb. of body weight

    DAY 2: Low carbohydrate intake, 0.5 grams per lb. of body weight
    High protein intake, 1. 5 grams per lb. of body weight
    Low fat intake, 1/4 gram for each lb. of body weight

    DAY 3: Low carbohydrate intake, 0.5 grams per lb. of body weight
    High protein intake, 1.5 grams per lb. of body weight
    Low fat intake, 1/4 gram for each lb. of body weight

    DAY 4: High carbohydrate intake, 2 grams per lb. of body weight
    Moderate protein intake, I gram per lb. of body weight
    Low fat intake, 1/4 gram per lb. of body weight

    Let's look at how this program would look for a person who weighs 200
    pounds.

    DAY 1: 300 grams carbs, 200 grams protem, 50 grams fat,
    Total cals = 2,450

    DAY 2: 100 grams carbs, 300 grams protein, 50 grams fat,
    Total cals = 2,050

    DAY 3: 100 grams carbs, 300 grams protein, 50 grains fat,
    Total cals = 2,050

    DAY 4: 400 grams carbs, 200 grams protein, 50 grams fat,
    Total cals = 2,850

    The actual diet might look like this (C=carbs, P =protein, F=fat, grams)

    DAY 1:
    8:00 AM 2 slices wheat bread toasted C-24, P-4, F-25 egg whites, 1 yolk scrambled C-0, P-20, F-62 cups skim milk C-24, P-16, F-01 whole grapefruit C-9, P-1, F-01 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0
    10:00 AM 1 banana C-27, P-1, F-0
    12:00 PM 1 baked potato C-35, P-4, F-01 chicken breast w/o skin C-0, P-27, F-31 slice wheat bread C-12, P-2, F-11 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0
    3:00 PM 1 baked potato C-35, P-4, F-0
    6:00 PM 4 oz. White fish C-0, P-22, F-91 cup brown rise C-50, P-5, F-11 cup raw spinach C-14, P-2, F-21 cup green beans C-8, P-2, F-0
    9:00 PM 1 cup yogurt C-17, P-13, F-31 banana C-27, P-1, F-01 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0

    DAY 2:
    8:00 AM 5 egg whites, 1 yolk scrambled C-0, P-20, F-6˝ baked potato C-18, P-2, F-01 whole grapefruit C-9, P-1, F-01 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0
    10:00 AM ˝ cup tuna C-0, P-22, F-6
    12:00 PM 2 chicken breast w/o skin C-0, P-54, F-63 oz. Low fat cheddar cheese C-3, P-21, F-121 cup lettuce (salad) W/ lemon C-2, P-1, F-01 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0
    3:00 PM 2 hard boiled eggs C-0, P-12, F-12˝ apple C-10, P-1, F-0
    6:00 PM 1 lb turkey C-10, P-42, F-101 cup broccoli C-7, P-5, F-0˝ cup carrots C-6, P-1, F-01 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0
    9:00 PM 3 egg whites C-0, P-15, F-0

    DAY 3: SAME AS DAY 2

    DAY 4:
    8:00 AM 6 pancakes w/ butter & syrup C-27, P-12, F-282 cups skim milk C-24, P-16, F-01 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0
    10:00 AM 1 cup yogurt C-17, P-13, F-33 oatmeal cookies C-30, P-3, F-61 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-3
    12:00 PM 2 cups pasta w/ meat sauce C-80, P-25, F-101 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0
    3:00 PM 2 hard boiled eggs C-0, P-12, F-121 cup brown rise C-50, P-5, F-1
    6:00 PM 2 chicken breast w/o skin C-0, P-54, F-62 cups pasta, plain C-70, P-14, F-4
    9:00 PM Shake with 1 cup frozen yogurt, 3 egg whites, 1 cup skim milk C-45, P-27, F-51 100% egg protein drink C-0, P-30, F-0


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    This example is one of hundreds of combinations which could fit the HI-LO Carb Diet outline. For some people, this might seem like a lot of food, for many it will seem like very little. Individuals may wish to adjust caloric down as much as 40%. Either way, the pattern must remain the same. The general theme behind this 1-2-1 pattern is as follows:

    DAY 1: Well balanced diet. Moderate intake of calories, protein, carbs, and low fat. Provides body with ample amount of energy Frequent meals keep metabolism up.

    DAY 2: Deprives active body of carbohydrates. High protein intake protects muscle from being used as fuel. Low fat prevents energy requirements from being met by intake of dietary fat. Well trained athletes will have high BMR and will burn up blood glucose and then go to fuel stored as glycogen in muscle and liver. Late in the day these reserves will run low and the body will begin to draw on fat reserves for fuel. Low insulin release also signals body to mobilize fat to be used as fuel.

    DAY 3: Diet is lacking in carbohydrates again. Body has been using fat reserves as fuel for about half of day 2 and continues to do so. The system has gone from drawing on glycogen for fuel to body fat stores solely. The body fat is broken down into glycerol and fatty acids. The glycerol is converted to PGAL and then glucose for fuel. The fatty acids are converted to acetyl CoA and then must go through the Kreb's cycle, and finally reverse glycolysis prior to being converted to glucose which the body can use to function. Late in day 3, this process will cause ketone bodies to build up. Ketone bodies are a byproduct of the breakdown of fat when carbohydrates are not available. A mild case of ketosis, which is a high concentration of ketone and acetone in the blood and liver, will set in by late on day 3. Since this ketosis only sets in for about 12 hours, it is not dangerous, in fact, it is desired. A person on this diet should regularly use Ketosta to measure their state of ketosis. These are small plastic sticks which can be purchased at a grocery store or pharmacy, You place a drop of urine on them which causes them to react to the amount of ketones in your urine. If there are a lot of ketones, the stick will turn dark purple, if there is no ketones present, the stick will not change in color. On this diet, a person wants to be in the light to moderate ketosis by the evening of day 3. This ensures that fat is actually being burned as fuel. If the ketostix are negative, carbohydrate levels need to go lower. If the levels are very dark then more carbs need to be eaten on the next day 3.

    DAY 4: This day is a high carbohydrate day. All ketosis is arrested with a high carb breakfast on this day. Since there will be an abundance of carbs we can be certain that protein will not be used as fuel, thus moderate protein is plenty for today, Carbohydrates are protein sparing, that is, they allow protein to
    be used for more important things than energy. The high calories, high carbs and frequent meals on this day keep the body's metabolism from slowing down. This is the key to the whole diet - not letting the basal metabolic rate (BMR) slow down like it does on an ordinary diet. Taking in 400 grams of carbohydrates
    today really fills out the muscles. This is a very dramatic reaction. On day 3, your muscles are starved for carbs and are flat, by the middle of day 4 you'll feel like you put on 5 pounds of muscle. This is the fun day to be certain, it allows for an intense overload workout and a great pump. Then you go back to day 1 to
    maintain a high metabolic rate and stabilize the body's functioning before dropping in on day 2 and 3 to burn up some more fat.

    I’ve seen people lose up to 1 lb of fat on each 4 day cycle. Usually, I will recommend that & person plan on a loss of 1 lb. of fat per week on this diet at the low end. Seven cycles of this program lasts about one month
    and is usually about as long as a person would want to go on this regimen unless they are dieting for a contest where up to 8 weeks on the diet may be necessary. Steroids play a small role in losing fat. Still, many lifters would not go on a diet like this without being on some kind of steroid. Many athletes feel
    that taking a low dosage of an anabolic like Deca or Primobolan while on a low carb diet will help insure that muscle mass is not sacrificed. I can see the logic in this but I don't think it is a key part of the diet's success. It would be unwise to use this diet during an “all out” steroid cycle as the body would not be able to do much with the steroids on such a limited calorie intake. I have seen many lifters use a diet like this for one month before they started their steroid cycles. This seems to have some advantages. Steroids
    seem to be more effective when you start out with lean muscles. This might be because the metabolic rate increases as the body loses fat or it may be that when the lifter goes on a low carb diet for very long, the body goes into a slightly catabolic state. Steroids work exceptionally well when they are introduced into a catabolic environment.

    Pre contest bodybuilders on a diet like this may want to use several items In stack, each in a low to moderate dosage, in an effort to keep androgen levels high. This can increase muscle hardness and total blood volume. This, in combination with low body fat, results in maximum vascularity and cuts.

    Although this diet is not for everyone, I will reiterate that I have seen it do remarkable things, It has many benefits over other conventional diets including the fact that it works fast and it never allows the body's
    metabolic rate to slow down or reach the plateau stage of fat loss. Even though our mind-set is geared towards gaining, gaining, gaining...eventually it becomes important to realize that muscles look bigger and much better when they aren't covered up with fat. After all, the fat lady at the circus has 25” arms; I unquestionably will sacrifice 6” to her and stick with a lean 19”.

  10. #10
    Community Veteran Mudge's Avatar
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    Quality carbs, and I prefer low carb. One bad thing, is fast adjustments to the diet, 500c-1000c per day should be the most playing room, 500 natural and 1k on gear, IMO.

    I will go down as low as ~50g carbs on a serious cut, if I were to cut right now though I'd go down to around 125ish.

    Old fashioned oats, sweet potato, brown rice, good carbs.

    Bread - I dont care how many grains it is, its still a refined grain, its crap.
    He who overcomes others has force; He who overcomes himself is strong. Lao-tzu

  11. #11
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    if u want 8% say say hello to 1. Cardo 3x a week and 2. Lean diet, i.e chicken breast, brown rice, no rifined carbos.

  12. #12
    Novice Bullfx's Avatar
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    hey thanks guys, in 10 wks Ill post my AFTER pictures...

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