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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Telling Your Doc, or Not Telling Your Doc?
    Originally posted by Riker28 from Elitefitness. There are some things in here that I never thought about.

    Any personal experience or opinions ??


    Telling Your Doc, or Not Telling Your Doc?

    What one needs to consider in terms of disclosure of AS use to a Doctor, and its possible effects upon your future.


    I have seen a few threads/comments about people asking whether or not to tell you Doc that you are ON, or have been ON.

    There are some things to consider, and the REAL issue or concern is not really telling the Doc at all.

    Your Medical Records Speak for you and your Doctor for Years.

    The real issue is not as much whether you tell your Doc, or not ..... the real issue is whether or not any record of your having taken steroids, or having test results which indicate abnormalities which are commonly attributable to steroid use, shows up in your medical records.

    The reason the medical records are the real problem, is that most of the time, when getting or changing medical insurance, the records are reviewed to see if they "want" to insure you. (This is a check for the sort of pre-existing-condition issue). If they find something very abnormal or something that is already a problem normally they will reject the new person from coverage.

    Now when you talk to your Doc, if they do everything strictly "by the book", then:

    … details of the conversation will be placed into your record as part of the information gathering. These are your history, symptoms and descriptions. If you describe symptoms and current conditions (like that fact that you are taking AS) then they will record this in your record. Also,

    … if any medical tests are performed, the results are placed into your record as well.

    For some Docs, anything you say, anything they do, any test results that come up, are ALL placed in your records - no excuses. They are strictly "by the book". This is the safest for them best in terms of their issues with liability, but it takes them a LOT of time, so many don’t go this far.

    Some Docs are more liberal.

    How do you find this out?

    What kind of Doc do YOU have?

    Well, ask your Doc. Ask him flat-out. Ask something like this (seriously).



    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I understand that parts of our conversation are recorded by you into my medical record. I also understand that if any tests are performed that in most cases, the results are placed in the record as well. My issue is this - There are times that I would like to discuss things with you that I DO NOT want to be in my record. Now, with all due respect to you and your duties, I was wondering:

    If I have a conversation with you, and I express that I do NOT want that conversation to be recorded or referenced in ANY manner in my record, can you honor that?

    Also,

    If any type of medical tests are performed on me, that may pertain to information that I do not wish to be entered into my records, is it also possible to NOT place those test results in my record? Meaning, is there a way to have tests performed anonymously so that if I have a "private" issue, and that requires that a test be performed, that we can do the test and see the results without them going into my record?
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Now, BOTH of these issues are important to ask your Doc. And here is why.

    The first issue is quite obvious. Lets say you tell your Doc that you have certain pains, or your kidneys hurt, or maybe your natural Test does not seem to be recovering, or your balls have shrunk and are taking a long time to get back to size … etc etc etc. And as part of you telling him all of the pertinent facts, you need to tell him that you have taken, or are currently taking, AS. Well, to give you a real diagnosis, and to SAFELY recommend a course of action (and maybe prescribe medicines) then the Doc needs to know that you were (or are) ON.

    Well, if you tell him, and he records it, then it’s in your record.

    And once there it is very very difficult to get anything removed. Trust me (there was even a Seinfeld episode about this .. LOL).

    The second issue is the one most guys overlook. Let’s say you ask your Doc that first question, and he is fine with honoring your request for privacy. Cool. You tell him what’s up, what hurts (or whatever) and you tell him that you are (or were) ON. He understands (disagrees probably with what you did …) but he does not record those details into your records. Cool. You think you are in the clear. …

    The Hidden Danger of Test Results

    NOW HERE IS WHERE MOST GUYS GET INTO TROUBLE.

    So maybe your Doc needs to have some tests performed. He takes blood and/or urine or whatever. He collects the sample, and PLACES YOUR NAME ON IT AND SENDS IT TO A LAB. Then the lab processes it and gets the results, which are presented/recorded with YOUR NAME ON IT. Then these results ARE PLACED INTO YOUR MEDICAL RECORDS.

    Once those results are in your records, they are VERY VERY difficult to get out.

    Now, if those test results sow terrible liver problems, or sky-high testosterone levels, or very high estrogen levels (for a man …… which may be causing gyno ….. ) etc, or anything else that tends to be "warning signs" that someone IS using AS, then if this goes into your records, its almost as if it says flat-out that you ARE on AS.

    See the problem?

    You may have a cool Doc, he may honor the fact that you do not want the conversation recorded. Fine, you tell him you are on Test and Fina, No problem. But you have some pains and he wants to run some tests. So he runs them. The tests (among other things ..) happen to show a Testosterone level of like 2500 (way way way way way beyond normal). OK, well, he looks at the results, he says you should be fine (he was worried about something else). You go home think all is cool. And now, your medical records have a history that shows that at SOME point your Testosterone levels were at 2500! Even though the Doc was cool, this is very incriminating data to have in your medical file.

    Now, its not a legal problem per se, no one is going to bust you (in terms of like a criminal charge or anything) for having that in your medical record.

    But, having that in your record is basically telling people that you DID use AS at some time.

    Why could that be a problem?

    Because some day, you may need to get new Medical Insurance.

    And,

    If your Medical Record does show that you had some very strange (attributable to AS) test results in the past, and you then try to get new Medical Coverage, then one of 2 scenarios is very likely:

    1 - You get rejected for coverage. When getting new insurance, they will check over your current medical records. If they see anything like this, in some cases, they will NOT insure you.

    2 - Maybe you get covered. Fine,. When changing onto new insurance, in many cases you are given a questionnaire where you are suppose to detail what your medical history is. Fine,. So maybe they did not check your Docs file, but they read YOUR statement of your history (you know, those long form where they list like every disease and you are supposed to check whether or not you have had it .. they list a bunch of medical problems …. You list whether or not you have had it , etc.). Now if you lie and say you did NOT ever use AS (I mean, who would admit to this on such a form ….) what can happen is that if you DO get approved to be covered and ever get sick, and if it gets costly, that’s when they will pour over your records. If they see the earlier test results (like the high Test levels) and then they see that on your form, you did NOT admit to this, then the insurance company will say you LIED on your application (true) and then they will have grounds to NOT cover you.

    Is getting insurance or not - something that I should be worried about?

    Now this may not be a huge problem for many people. If you work for a large corporation with a great group coverage plan, then rejection based on pre-existing conditions is FAR FAR less likely. The insurance company maybe has like 2000 people in that company that they are insuring, and statistically, there IS room for them to deal with a fewer high-risk patients. Plus the fact they the insurer wants the big contract SO bad, means that the chances of being rejected for insurance due to a pre-existing condition are much less if your employer has a LOT of people on the insurance plan. If the employer is small, or if you work for yourself, run a small business, are a consultant, etc etc etc, you are way out of luck - they will reject you in a heartbeat or charge you an astronomical sum.

    Many guys will say "no big deal, I work at a big company" … but you never know. Some people DO get rejected regardless of the company (and imagine the insurance company telling your employer WHY). Maybe some day you will want to work for a small company, start a business, become a consultant ... who knows.

    Maybe some day you will have a family, and this will really become an issue.

    So, what is one to do?

    Well, to NOT tell your Doctor, when there may be some critical medical issue that may be caused by - or made worse by AS use, is just dumb. And you may be threatening your health in the process.

    A good thing to do is to ask your Doctor those questions I posed above (will he keep stuff private … and can or will he get anonymous test results ..) BEFORE a big problem comes up. Depending upon your answer, you now have information to work with,. Maybe you know that he will be fine with it. Maybe you know that you need to find a new Doc! Maybe you will find (the most common scenario) that he/she will honor a private conversation, but when it comes to test results, he will have to have a name attached to them.

    With this knowledge, you will be in better shape to determine how YOU want things to proceed.

    I hope this helps.
    Stone Cold..............................Never Too Old



    Disclaimer: Steroidology.com does not promote the use of anabolic steroids without a doctor's prescription. The information we share is for entertainment purposes only.

  2. #2
    Junior Bodybuilder Hammer's Avatar
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    I've always told my doc. He's been my doc for almost 20 years and by telling him I've learned a shit load of useful things. if you have a good relation with your doc tell him he could be very helpful.

  3. #3
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    I think you should be frank with your dr....but find out what is being charted....my roomie has been denied life insurance because of a comment in a dr. report

  4. #4
    Rookie BUFFDAWG10's Avatar
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    I think the KEY is really knowing and trusting your Doc. You need to have that confidence & trust in him before confessing personal info. like that.

  5. #5
    Novice wolverine01's Avatar
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    Dont tell,it could haunt you later,they will write it in your file,
    I say no...

  6. #6
    Pro Bodybuilder DangerousGrounds's Avatar
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    Originally posted by BUFFDAWG10
    I think the KEY is really knowing and trusting your Doc. You need to have that confidence & trust in him before confessing personal info. like that.
    I agree you must trust you dr's hard to find good ones with open minds.

  7. #7
    Juice Authority
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    Fuck! I didn't even think of this!! I'm with Kaiser and I had some blood work done last year when I took a physical and my Testosterone levels were above 1200. When they got the results back they asked me if I was taking AS and I told them NO. When they questioned me about the high-test levels I told them that I was taking OTC Norandro (testosterone enhancer).

    I want to switch insurance companies because Kaiser sucks balls. Now will this cause me to get declined at the new insurance company if I'm on a group plan??? Do they really check your fucking medical records for group plans???
    Last edited by Juice Authority; 02-11-2003 at 11:15 PM.

  8. #8
    Rookie BUFFDAWG10's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Juice Authority
    Fuck! I didn't even think of this!! I'm with Kaiser and I had some blood work done last year when I took a physical and my Testosterone levels were above 1200. When they got the results back they asked me if I was taking AS and I told them NO. When they questioned me about the high-test levels I told them that I was taking OTC Norandro (testosterone enhancer).

    I want to switch insurance companies because Kaiser sucks balls. Now will this cause me to get declined at the new insurance company if I'm on a group plan??? Do they really check your fucking medical records for group plans???
    I really don't know, but once you confess this to your doc and he writes it down somewhere in your file it is there for good! Do you really want that lingering around to come back and haunt you one day!

  9. #9
    Amateur Bodybuilder saturn's Avatar
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    I don't trust Drs at all. I have told my last Dr about my steroid use because my blood pressure was a little high when I went in for some pain I had from a auto accedent. I asked him to keep it confidential but I don't trust him enough to know that he didn't record it in my medical records. I think if you absolutly have to tell then ask him not to record it otherwise don't say a thing about it.

  10. #10
    Junior Bodybuilder LongBall's Avatar
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    My wife runs a medical clinic which allows me to have my own group of Dr's for questions and such. She has told me, and I have shared this with some elite board members about what can happen when something is put in your file. everything that SC posted is true. My wife has seen it all at one time or another and the insurance agencies will not think twice about screwing you over. It is best to see a few docs and find which one you can relate best with. I am still looking for my next primary care physician(wifes clinic not covered by my plan) that I can talk things over with. On a side note, I did find out my Orthopedic surgeon is a juicer also, he handles most of the guys at my gym for injuries.


    LongBall

  11. #11
    Rookie BUFFDAWG10's Avatar
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    Originally posted by LongBall
    My wife runs a medical clinic which allows me to have my own group of Dr's for questions and such. She has told me, and I have shared this with some elite board members about what can happen when something is put in your file. everything that SC posted is true. My wife has seen it all at one time or another and the insurance agencies will not think twice about screwing you over. It is best to see a few docs and find which one you can relate best with. I am still looking for my next primary care physician(wifes clinic not covered by my plan) that I can talk things over with. On a side note, I did find out my Orthopedic surgeon is a juicer also, he handles most of the guys at my gym for injuries.


    LongBall
    That's why it is a good idea to keep it to yourself unless it is absolutely necessary to reveal that type of info. to your doc!

  12. #12
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    This certainly raises some very interesting questions.
    Stone Cold..............................Never Too Old



    Disclaimer: Steroidology.com does not promote the use of anabolic steroids without a doctor's prescription. The information we share is for entertainment purposes only.

  13. #13
    Community Veteran house1's Avatar
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    my doc knows everything. i like it that way. i trust him with my life. in order for him to take care of you when a problem developes he needs to know everything so he can look in the right direction..

    find a good doc feel him out for awhile
    then when you feel you can trust him tell him everything.

    this way proper tests can be done and he can steer you in the right direction so you can stay as healthy as possible.

    it all boils down to finding a good doc.

  14. #14
    Novice fable's Avatar
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    my doctor is an asshole

  15. #15
    Pro Bodybuilder DangerousGrounds's Avatar
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    anyone know any good Dr's in IL.
    I've yet to find one..

  16. #16
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    thats why you find one you know is on your side... like the board member here and on other boards that goes by the name SWALE.

    By not having insurance cover the consultation, they can not ask for medical records.

    I would not trust my general practitioner with my use. It will bite you in the ass. If you get cancer, heart disease or anything remotely attributable to AAS, your insurance will deny you coverage and then your f'ed.

    Go to your GP for normal health issues. Go to a professional that actually knows about Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) and you can trust for your Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) issues... and any related health issues arising from AAS.

    Usually it would be pointless to see your general practitioner for any of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) related concerns anyways, considering they often don't know shit about them.

  17. #17
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    I think it really depends on how cool your doctor is. My doc kept everything off the record and ordered me blood tests to monitor my levels for me. It was kind of funny that I was the patient, yet I knew much more about AS than he did. I gave him some info so he could better educate himself on the subject.

  18. #18
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    It took me years to find the right Doc. I met him at the gym. He is a bodybuilder and understands. I have him look over everything and do all my blood work with him. Its a great thing to have that hook up, I never take it for granted either.

    As far as telling a new or different Doc I wouldnt unless it had something to do with what was wrong.

    A friend of mine was in a car accident and the doctor told him that his build and muscles saved him from getting hurt worse. He was the same doctor that was preaching to him about how steriods were bad and evil prior to the crash. Go figure.

  19. #19
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    ^
    Stone Cold..............................Never Too Old



    Disclaimer: Steroidology.com does not promote the use of anabolic steroids without a doctor's prescription. The information we share is for entertainment purposes only.

  20. #20
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    i would never tell my doc.

  21. #21
    Junior Bodybuilder asianlifter808's Avatar
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    this is great stuff!

  22. #22
    Mr. Homewrecker Supercharged's Avatar
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    Damn! I have an ankle injury that will require surgery to be corrected. I have elongated ligaments or something? Anyway, when I first started going to my foot doc (podiatrist) for the pain, he couldn't figure out what was up with my ankle. X-rays, multiple MRI's................nothing. He said everything looked good. He couldn't understand why I had so much pain. After my 5th or 6th appointment with him (I was getting tired of seeing him at this point) I told him I had used steroids previously, and asked if that had anything to do with it. He said no way. He said he would have noticed right away if I had any joint damage due to steroids, from the x-rays or the MRI results. He left it at that, and the steroid thing never came up again.

    Now I'm shittin myself, wondering if that info was documented.

  23. #23
    Its a Celebration Bitches daan69's Avatar
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    my doctor is an old friend of the family and i feel confident anything i tell him or have told him about my Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) use stays confidential.

  24. #24
    Novice blue_pill's Avatar
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    As a urologist i would urge all of you guys to disclose use of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) if you ever have to come and see me with testicular problems or later in life with prostate problems.
    We can negotitate at the time how much of it goes into your medical notes and If necessary it doesn't have to go in. Certainly in my practice in the UK (private and NHS), like most of my colleagues, I am very sensitive to potential future repercussions of medical notes on my patient's ease in obtaining life assurance and private healthcare cover.
    But back to the main points:
    If you come and see me with a benign testicular lump and I measure your testicular tumour marker blood tests after you have been on gear, especially if you have used HCG ,then they are going to be screwed up. They may come back so out of kilter that I want to cut your testicle off. If you share information about your use of juice then we can make an informed decision together about whether that is necessary.
    And with the prostate problems- again its useful to know whether you have accelerated prostate growth due to higher testosterone and DHT levels. If your PSA is high as a result of this it might not save you a prostate biopsy but it will mean I may be more reassured by a negative biposy showing enlargement only and not want to do you all over again.
    In general if you are at all concerned that the problem you are seeing your doctor about may be related to use of juice then make a negotiated disclosure of this to your doctor. It may save you loads of unecessary and expensive tests and your doctor will be better placed to give you accurate health advice (assuming they know jack about steroids!)

  25. #25
    njmuscle2002
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    I wouldnt tell my dr. unless you had to -(1), (2) - before you do HAVE to tell him, have the discussion that StoneColdNTO outlined - that was great.
    Insurance co's WILL do everything to not insure you/disclaim on prior pre-existing if they can.
    I know I work in that profession.

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