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  1. #1
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    TREN - Pure F-ing Magic cycle
    TREN - Pure F-ing Magic cycle:


    I am starting to plan next years major (not a beginners cycle) cycle with the goal of getting my very stubborn body parts up to snuff. *All my relevant information/experience is below the cycle here (below red text). I am planning the PFM (Pure F-ing Magic cycle - as described by some) with the inclusion of HGH. Below is the general cycle outline. My major questions are about ancillary drugs, and PCT (I'll stay on the HGH the whole time, but I am not sure about dosing around the cycle or during PCT).

    What do I do to keep hair loss at a min?
    How to run HCG?
    How to do the post cycle therapy (pct)?
    HGH dose changes around cycle time and during post cycle therapy (pct)?
    Any other helpful advice?
    Any helpful feedback by the experienced would be very much appreciated.


    2-4iu HGH ED (6-12 months on, and on at least 2 months before the AAS kicks in).


    12-14 week Cycle:

    500-600 mg Test Prop a week

    50-100mg Tren- A EOD (start low and work up slowly to maybe 100mg as body gets used to it ***8211; 50mg ***8211; 4 weeks, 75mg 4 weeks, 100mg 4 weeks if all goes well)

    75-100mg Masteron EOD (not sure if this should be full duration of cycle)

    HCG throughout the whole cycle (250iu E3D?)






    Stats, background info, experience:

    I'm 42, been weight training for 27 years, am about 230 (moderately lean) at 6'0", have done 4-5 small to moderate cycles, but that was a long time ago, in my 20's. Been mainly clean ever since. Took some years off, in my 30's, but have been training hard again for quite a while this year and getting back to peak shape again. No health problems, no injuries. I eat immaculately. Went to school for nutrition and training education, so I have all that down pat. I'm gearing up for a 12 week 500mg test cyp. with Proviron cycle in a month and a half to get back to my past peak shape. I'll come off that and then go clean for a little while. I'm already gearing up big time for next year with a big eye on HGH at 2-4 iu a day all year (I'm figuring all that out right now and have more learning to do). I am thinning a bit in the hair department and want to keep as much as possible before I dump $10,000 into a hair transplant in the next couple years (I'm not shaving it off). I am able to train at such high levels of intensity that it is quite possible for me to strain a tendon. I plan on the HGH being the golden ticket for collagen production and injury prevention while on this major cycle. I have not done Tren or Masteron before. I'd like to start with Tren's general lower dose and work up carefully to avoid nasty sides.

    As apposed to all my upper body, I have always had major problems with getting my legs up (calves, quads and hams) due to a high percentage of slow twitch muscle fibers there (not an excuse). I always train legs harder than anything else and love doing so. I love squating and all that (and love Hack Squats as my name hints at) love ultra high intensity, so that is not the issue (please spare me any advice in that area - thank you). I've been known to do drop sets on squats until I collapse and puke, so I have that psycho training intensity down.

    So, next year I want to do everything I can to really give these legs hells fury and see what I can do to them. I could have competed previously with my upper body mass and symmetry, but could not previously get the legs in balance. Now, at 42 I am going to give it my all! I am going to train nothing but legs on this cycle (maybe a touch of upper body maintenance) on a routing that will look something like this:

    Day #1 calves only
    Day#2 Rest
    Day #3 Quads only
    Day#4 Rest
    Day#5 Hams and low back
    Day#6 rest
    Day #7 back to calves or a little upper body maintenance...
    Repeat.

    Lastly, this will be sort of a do or die cycle in terms of competing. If the legs do not come up enough, then I will pretty much know I don't have the genetics in the lower area for competition. If that happens I'll just have to settle for being a 240lb stud.
    Last edited by Hacksquater; 04-21-2010 at 01:49 PM.

  2. #2
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    Hack I hope reach form were your able to compete-best of luck bro.

    With that said you mentioned in your post you can train with the intensity were its possible to injure.You all so said your gearing up with a cyp/proviron run soon to help get back to peak shape to start your training for a possible comp in the near future.I was wordering if you have saw the thread on increasing collagen synthesis with nandrolones.I know your planning on runing HGH for a year but some added protection could never hurt.Increase skeletal muscle & collagen synthesis with certain AAS
    Looking forward to reading your updates,wish you the best bro

  3. #3
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    FYI......250mg E4D = 437mg/week....not 500
    Stone Cold..............................Never Too Old



    Disclaimer: Steroidology.com does not promote the use of anabolic steroids without a doctor's prescription. The information we share is for entertainment purposes only.

  4. #4
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drewbolic View Post
    Hack I hope reach form were your able to compete-best of luck bro.

    With that said you mentioned in your post you can train with the intensity were its possible to injure.You all so said your gearing up with a cyp/proviron run soon to help get back to peak shape to start your training for a possible comp in the near future.I was wondering if you have saw the thread on increasing collagen synthesis with nandrolones.I know your planning on runing HGH for a year but some added protection could never hurt.Increase skeletal muscle & collagen synthesis with certain AAS
    Looking forward to reading your updates,wish you the best bro
    Thanks. I did read that excellent artical. I think all the info in it I read was sound and helpful. I just kind of wanted a test-ish cycle for starters. I'll be slowly working up the intensity this year. By the time I am on HGH the intensity will be really going.

    Quote Originally Posted by StoneColdNTO View Post
    FYI......250mg E4D = 437mg/week....not 500
    Yes, thanks, I'll have to adjust that.

    Any more feedback?

  5. #5
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    No feedback? Too much to read? Just read the cycle part you b-builders!

  6. #6
    Moderator juced_porkchop's Avatar
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    whats the langth for these compounds?
    only doses listed.
    Follow me on Twitter for advanced in-depth peptide, supplement and AAS knowledge, along with all things bodybuilding! Follow me-> @Juced_porkchop

  7. #7
    Amateur Bodybuilder JMB1's Avatar
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    How long are you running this cycle?
    Sounds intense. Masteron for the whole cycle..?
    I would add a bit more test per week and run it longer. 12 weeks is just enough to
    get wet. I understand you want to work on your legs.
    If your going to do this monster cycle and possibly compete,
    how can you not train your entire body and think you have a chance to place?

  8. #8
    Moderator juced_porkchop's Avatar
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    ????????????????
    Follow me on Twitter for advanced in-depth peptide, supplement and AAS knowledge, along with all things bodybuilding! Follow me-> @Juced_porkchop

  9. #9
    Senior Moderator Teutonic's Avatar
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    Dude..I m sure you have addressed all the above inquiries; I agree with the test increase and wish you well as it appears you ve done some homework..I wish you well and am real curious as to your progress...best of luck to my friend.
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  10. #10
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    Just curious why not Prop sinse your already pinning EOD? and length of the compounds would be good

  11. #11
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Sorry guys, I work 3 jobs been very busy lately! Still have PCT questions (above in initial thread)? My experience with PCT is a bit limited.

    Quote Originally Posted by juced_porkchop View Post
    whats the langth for these compounds?
    only doses listed.
    With the exception of the HGH, I was thinking about 12 weeks, but uncertain. I was going to do the HGH either 6 or 12 months. The AAS not sure an ideal length?

    Quote Originally Posted by JMB1 View Post
    How long are you running this cycle?
    Sounds intense. Masteron for the whole cycle..?
    I would add a bit more test per week and run it longer. 12 weeks is just enough to
    get wet. I understand you want to work on your legs.
    If your going to do this monster cycle and possibly compete,
    how can you not train your entire body and think you have a chance to place?
    I was thinking 12 weeks. More than 12 weeks? Like how many would you suggest to be ideal here? Should Masteron not be done all cycle in your opinion?

    The cycle is, as stated, to bring up the legs. Addition cycling (if the legs get to where I need them) would be for contest. I am patient. If I am totally symetrical at 240+ and lean, get critically overlooked by a IFBB pro (I train at some gyms where a lot of them are) and they say "dude, you could do some damage" well then I might do the investment. But one day at a time...


    Quote Originally Posted by Teutonic View Post
    Dude..I m sure you have addressed all the above inquiries; I agree with the test increase and wish you well as it appears you ve done some homework..I wish you well and am real curious as to your progress...best of luck to my friend.
    Thanks. I am doing my homework! If all goes well I will present my progress here. Should have the first cycle going in less than 8 weeks if shipments are on time and all gear is good.





    Quote Originally Posted by Deepsouth View Post
    Just curious why not Prop sinse your already pinning EOD? and length of the compounds would be good
    Good point. I have always done Cyp, but Prop would make sense here, so I'll change that. Thanks.
    Last edited by Hacksquater; 04-21-2010 at 01:06 PM.

  12. #12
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by juced_porkchop View Post
    ????????????????
    Sorry! I have my own business to run and 2jobs (but soon I will cut that down to my business only and training!) and am traveling in and out of town ocassionally. Once in a while I am gone a couple days...

  13. #13
    Amateur Bodybuilder JMB1's Avatar
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    Right on man, I would run the test for the duration to get max gains and full
    utilization of hyperplasia while your running the GH.
    500mg of T might not get the job done either. Not saying what is right or wrong.
    If you decide to compete, drop the T accordingly. I never come off test (TRT)
    Also, Masteron is a direct precursor of dihydrotestosterone (bye bye hair)
    I find Mast. is only needed about 6 weeks out. Can't imagine a year of it. Incredible compound though. Keep us posted with some pics! JM

  14. #14
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMB1 View Post
    Right on man, I would run the test for the duration to get max gains and full
    utilization of hyperplasia while your running the GH.
    Definitely will be on Test 500-600 mg a week 12-14 weeks.

    500mg of T might not get the job done either. Not saying what is right or wrong.
    I'm certainly open to more if it will benefit.


    If you decide to compete, drop the T accordingly.
    Won't be competing on this one just getting the long awaited wheels.

    I never come off test (TRT)
    Wow. Makes me wonder if after the big cycle to run testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) for a while (w the 2iu HGH) then after some time go off. Instead of going off and into PCT directly. Wonder if that would be easier on the body and better to keep most of the gains.

    Also, Masteron is a direct precursor of dihydrotestosterone (bye bye hair)
    Nothing to blunt this??????? If not, I'll certainly run it shorter in duration. Does it just all fall out with the first injection???!!!


    I find Mast. is only needed about 6 weeks out. Can't imagine a year of it.
    No one said a year of it! Sorry if I was not clear. I was originally intending 12 weeks, but could even cut that down if I will lose all my hair!

    Incredible compound though. Keep us posted with some pics! JM
    Last edited by Hacksquater; 04-21-2010 at 01:47 PM.

  15. #15
    Amateur Bodybuilder JMB1's Avatar
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    HSQ, I misunderstood about your proposed dosage schedule. I mach III
    my head, so am not up to date on
    what works to stop/combat hair loss.
    finasteride..? Someone else will have an answer no doubt.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hacksquater View Post
    Definitely will be on Test 500-600 mg a week 12-14 weeks.



    I'm certainly open to more if it will benefit.
    Won't be competing on this one just getting the long awaited wheels.
    Wow. Makes me wonder if after the big cycle to run testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) for a while (w the 2iu HGH) then after some time go off. Instead of going off and into PCT directly. Wonder if that would be easier on the body and better to keep most of the gains.

    Nothing to blunt this??????? If not, I'll certainly run it shorter in duration. Does it just all fall out with the first injection???!!!

    No one said a year of it! Sorry if I was not clear. I was originally intending 12 weeks, but could even cut that down if I will lose all my hair!

  16. #16
    Moderator juced_porkchop's Avatar
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    well I run mast the WHOLE clcye or atleas 10-12 weeks of it. hair loss isnot an issue for me.

    I would do somthing like this:
    12-14 week Cycle:

    wk1-12 500-600 mg TestE a week

    wk4-11 (8wks) 50-100mg Tren- A EOD

    wk1-12 400mg ew Maste or mast blend like mastaplex200

    PCT wk13-17 Nolvadex 30mg ED first 2 weeks / 20mg ed last 2 weeks.

    *hcg i only used to use last 5 weeks of cycle leading upto PCT but stopping AT PCT at 500iu 2X a week*
    HCG throughout the whole cycle (250iu E3D?)


    keep an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) on hand like letro.
    water should not be a issue.
    short esters are not really needed unless clearance time or time in genrall is an issue (for testP atleast) and for tren I can see the ression sinde with its possible sides dose can be adjusted quicly and stopped quicly but other then that i say go longer ester unless yoru getting a crazy deal for soem reez on the short esters.

    thats how I would do it
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  17. #17
    Amateur Bodybuilder JMB1's Avatar
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    I agree with you on weeks 4-12.
    HCG E3D at 250iu will keep raisin sack at
    bay.

    Quote Originally Posted by juced_porkchop View Post
    well I run mast the WHOLE clcye or atleas 10-12 weeks of it. hair loss isnot an issue for me.

    I would do somthing like this:
    12-14 week Cycle:

    wk1-12 500-600 mg TestE a week

    wk4-11 (8wks) 50-100mg Tren- A EOD

    wk1-12 400mg ew Maste or mast blend like mastaplex200

    PCT wk13-17 Nolvadex 30mg ED first 2 weeks / 20mg ed last 2 weeks.

    *hcg i only used to use last 5 weeks of cycle leading upto PCT but stopping AT PCT at 500iu 2X a week*
    HCG throughout the whole cycle (250iu E3D?)


    keep an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) on hand like letro.
    water should not be a issue.
    short esters are not really needed unless clearance time or time in genrall is an issue (for testP atleast) and for tren I can see the ression sinde with its possible sides dose can be adjusted quicly and stopped quicly but other then that i say go longer ester unless yoru getting a crazy deal for soem reez on the short esters.

    thats how I would do it

  18. #18
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by juced_porkchop View Post
    well I run mast the WHOLE clcye or atleas 10-12 weeks of it. hair loss isnot an issue for me.

    I would do somthing like this:
    12-14 week Cycle:

    wk1-12 500-600 mg TestE a week

    wk4-11 (8wks) 50-100mg Tren- A EOD

    wk1-12 400mg ew Maste or mast blend like mastaplex200

    post cycle therapy (pct) wk13-17 Nolvadex 30mg ED first 2 weeks / 20mg ed last 2 weeks.

    *hcg i only used to use last 5 weeks of cycle leading upto post cycle therapy (pct) but stopping AT post cycle therapy (pct) at 500iu 2X a week*
    HCG throughout the whole cycle (250iu E3D?)


    keep an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) on hand like letro.
    water should not be a issue.
    short esters are not really needed unless clearance time or time in genrall is an issue (for testP atleast) and for tren I can see the ression sinde with its possible sides dose can be adjusted quicly and stopped quicly but other then that i say go longer ester unless yoru getting a crazy deal for soem reez on the short esters.

    thats how I would do it
    Excellent feedback thanks man!


    Quote Originally Posted by Matt W View Post
    correct me if I'm wrong, but masteron will promote hairloss, right? Not been a problem for me with sides, lucky i guess.

    I'd scrap the masteron, up the test to 750mg/week 16 weeks, up the tren to 75-100 mg ED for 8 weeks, and taper off the cycle last 3 weeks with Winstrol (winny) tabs@ 100-150mg ED.

    my .02
    I read recently that it does not promote as much hair loss in the real world as most write ups (profiles say). Yes, lucky!

    Although you have on your profile that you are a novice, I think there is some weight to your idea. More test, drop the Masteron would maybe promote as much or more gains with more water issues. But I don't care about water on this cycle so this is a viable option.


    I just wonder if HGH, Test (more test) and tren is as almost as good as it gets in terms of sheer mass (not including some of the other more exotic things like insulin...)?
    Last edited by Hacksquater; 04-22-2010 at 08:42 PM.

  19. #19
    IncreasedMyT @ ULV THE-DET-OAK's Avatar
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    so your on TRT?- you dont need to worry about PCT
    Need TRT? >>>>>>> Call IMT >>>>>>>>>Real Programs, Real Results

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  20. #20
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THE-DET-OAK View Post
    so your on TRT?- you dont need to worry about PCT
    No I'm not on TRT.

    I was basically asking if you went from a great cycle (like the one mentioned above) straight into testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) with staying on HGH for a while too and then say a few months down the road went off the testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) (still on HGH)would you then have an easier recovery and keep more gains?

  21. #21
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMB1 View Post
    I agree with you on weeks 4-12.
    HCG E3D at 250iu will keep raisin sack at
    bay.
    Definitely want to keep the raisins! LOL

  22. #22
    IncreasedMyT @ ULV THE-DET-OAK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hacksquater View Post
    No I'm not on TRT.

    I was basically asking if you went from a great cycle (like the one mentioned above) straight into testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) with staying on HGH for a while too and then say a few months down the road went off the testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) (still on HGH)would you then have an easier recovery and keep more gains?
    HGH has actually been shown to increase T levels-so if your not on TRT-i would do my post cycle therapy (pct) straight away-while running the HGH concurrently
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  23. #23
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THE-DET-OAK View Post
    HGH has actually been shown to increase T levels-so if your not on TRT-i would do my post cycle therapy (pct) straight away-while running the HGH concurrently
    That sounds good. Did not catch that hgh raises T. So it might be best to do hgh 9 or so months 2iu daily 3 months before cycle, 4iu during cycle and post cycle therapy (pct), the back to 2iu for a couple months then off. Seems such an approach might help keeps gains.

  24. #24
    Trained and Educated Hacksquater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt W View Post
    The winn will help dry you out, but you could take a small amount of Arimdex during cycle if you bloat. I run test @12 weeks and find that test @16-20 weeks is the ticket. Maybe start cycle with dbol for 3-4 weeks.

    have ever run tren? sleeping like 2-3 hours a night, sucks ass.

    masteron itself isn't a potent compound, it sort of enhances the fx of test, but it didn't really do shit for me.
    I'm liking the 16-20 week idea and will consider a lengthening of the AAS part. Also maybe a small amount of Arimidex. Not sure about DBol with High Test, Tren and HGH though (although lord knows I love Dbol)..

    I will ease into Tren to try avoiding the sides.

    As far as drying out on Winn, I appreciate the suggestion, but no need. I can eat really good and do cardio and keep water mostly under control. Don't need to be hard as a rock, just want to get those legs up!

  25. #25
    Pro Bodybuilder R1rider's Avatar
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    good luck to you hacksquater

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